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Yue De: count from Snake to the year branch

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Yue De: count from Snake to the year
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Yue De is a Zi Wei minor star placed by the birth-year branch: treat Snake as Rat and count forward. A 12-year table, charts with Life at Tiger and a five-place gap with Quan Shu juan 2 set it apart from the BaZi star.

The short version7 min read

Yue De is a minor star placed by the birth-year branch alone: treat the Snake position as Rat, count forward to the branch of the birth year, and the palace where the count stops is where it sits.

  • Within one year pillar, changing the birth month, day or hour leaves Yue De where it is; the twelve year branches take twelve different positions, one each.
  • The Quan Shu juan 2 line on Wikisource says Yue De starts "from the Rat position", while the engine behind the site starts at Snake, five places apart; the gap should be recorded, not smoothed over.
  • BaZi has a "Moon Virtue noble" too, but it looks up a stem from the month branch, whereas Zi Wei Yue De turns the birth-year branch into a palace.
Eighteen seconds: how a Rat year reaches Snake, the one counting rule, and three things to align before reading.

Read first

What do Zi Wei's supporting, malefic and minor stars actually do? ↗

Treat Snake as Rat, then count to the birth year

Yue De (月德) is a minor star in the chart, placed by the branch of the birth year and by nothing else. Take the Snake position and treat it as "Rat", then count forward in branch order until you reach the branch of the birth year. The palace where the count stops is the palace of Yue De.

A ring of the twelve branches: for a Rat birth year Yue De sits at Snake, for a Horse birth year at Pig; both arcs run five places forward from the birth-year branch.Open the full-size diagram

The ring lists the twelve branches and each arc runs from the birth-year branch to Yue De; the positions follow the site engine and were checked against all sixty year pillars.

The picture takes two birth years. For a Rat year, the first name counted from Snake is Rat itself, so Yue De sits at Snake. For a Horse year the count runs from Rat to Horse, which takes you from Snake round to Pig. Both arcs are five places long, because Yue De always sits five positions after the birth-year branch. As one more worked case, take a Rabbit year: Rabbit is the fourth of the twelve branches, the fourth position counted from Snake is Monkey, and Yue De sits at Monkey.

Twelve birth years, twelve landing points

Each of the twelve branches is counted once and each of the twelve landing points is used once, so no two birth years share a position. In the table below the left column is the branch holding Yue De, and the right column comes from twelve real charts whose Life palace is at Tiger, showing what that position is called on the chart.

Birth yearYue De atPalace, Life at TigerRat yearSnakePropertyOx yearHorseCareerTiger yearGoatFriendsRabbit yearMonkeyTravelDragon yearRoosterHealthSnake yearDogWealthHorse yearPigChildrenGoat yearRatPartnerMonkey yearOxSiblingsRooster yearTigerLifeDog yearRabbitParentsPig yearDragonWellbeingThe right column reads one real chart per year from 1984 to 1995, all with Life at Tiger; in a Rooster year Yue De falls on the Life palace itself
Enlarge diagram · scroll sideways to read
Birth yearYue De atPalace, Life at TigerRat yearSnakePropertyOx yearHorseCareerTiger yearGoatFriendsRabbit yearMonkeyTravelDragon yearRoosterHealthSnake yearDogWealthHorse yearPigChildrenGoat yearRatPartnerMonkey yearOxSiblingsRooster yearTigerLifeDog yearRabbitParentsPig yearDragonWellbeingThe right column reads one real chart per year from 1984 to 1995, all with Life at Tiger; in a Rooster year Yue De falls on the Life palace itself
For each of the twelve birth-year branches, the branch where Yue De sits and the palace name it takes on a chart whose Life palace is at Tiger.

The right column shows a pattern. Each year later, the Yue De branch moves one place forward while the palace name steps one place back, in the order Property, Career, Friends, Travel and so on. That is because branches are counted forward while the twelve palaces run the other way round the chart (the Siblings palace sits on the branch just before the Life palace). So for one birth year, moving the Life palace rewrites every name: the branch of Yue De does not change, but what that branch is called is decided by the Life palace.

One line of text, two starting points

For the placement of Yue De, the chapter on star placement in the Complete Book of Zi Wei Dou Shu (紫微斗数全书, "Quan Shu" for short), juan 2, has one line:

Tian De starts from the Rooster position, counted as Rat, and runs forward to the Grand Duke of the current year. Yue De starts from the Rat position, counted as Rat, and runs forward to the Grand Duke of the current year.

Zi Wei Dou Shu Quan Shu, juan 2, "Rules for Tian De, Yue De and Jie Shen" (Wikisource text), our translation

Tian De starts at Rooster, which matches the engine. Yue De is written as starting from Rat, while the engine starts at Snake. Read literally, a Rat year counts from Rat to Rat and Yue De shares the position of the Grand Duke (太岁, the cell of the year branch itself); in the engine Yue De sits five positions after it. The line also says "the current year", whereas a rule a little later in the same juan, for Jie Lu (截路) and Kong Wang (空亡) adds a note, "by the birth year", and the site casts a birth chart from the branch of the birth year.

Juan 2, Wikisource textread literallyStart: RatCount to: Grand Duke of the yearRat year: Yue De at Rat, same cell as the Grand DukeTian De: start at RoosterSite enginenatal chart by birth yearStart: SnakeCount to: branch of the birth yearRat year: Yue De at Snake, five after the Grand DukeTian De: start at Rooster, as in the bookIn the same line Tian De agrees and the start of Yue De does not
Enlarge diagram · scroll sideways to read
Juan 2, Wikisource textread literallyStart: RatCount to: Grand Duke of the yearRat year: Yue De at Rat, same cell as the Grand DukeTian De: start at RoosterSite enginenatal chart by birth yearStart: SnakeCount to: branch of the birth yearRat year: Yue De at Snake, five after the Grand DukeTian De: start at Rooster, as in the bookIn the same line Tian De agrees and the start of Yue De does not
The Wikisource text of juan 2 starts Yue De at Rat and the engine starts it at Snake, five places apart; both start Tian De at Rooster.

A pair four places apart: Yue De and Tian De

The book writes the two stars in one rule, and in the engine they also travel as a pair. Tian De starts at Rooster and Yue De at Snake, and Rooster lies four places after Snake, so in every birth year Tian De sits four positions after Yue De.

Rat yearRatbirth year5 onSnakeYue De4 moreRoosterTian DeHorse yearHorsebirth year5 onPigYue De4 moreRabbitTian DeFour places from Yue De to Tian De, wrapping from Pig through Rat and Ox to Rabbit
Enlarge diagram · scroll sideways to read
Rat yearRatbirth year5 onSnakeYue De4 moreRoosterTian DeHorse yearHorsebirth year5 onPigYue De4 moreRabbitTian DeFour places from Yue De to Tian De, wrapping from Pig through Rat and Ox to Rabbit
In a Rat year Yue De is at Snake and Tian De at Rooster; in a Horse year Yue De is at Pig and Tian De at Rabbit; Tian De is always four places after Yue De.

Tian De has its own counting rule and a same-name list that meets this one; both are treated in the Tian De article.

Same name, different method: the BaZi Moon Virtue

BaZi has a star called Moon Virtue noble as well, and the two are easy to mix up. Side by side the differences are plain:

BaZi Moon VirtueZi Wei Yue DeBased onMonth branch, grouped by triadBirth-year branchWhat it returnsA heavenly stemA palaceExampleTiger month (Tiger-Horse-Dog group) gives Yang FireRat year gives SnakeWhere it landsOn a stem in the four pillarsOne of the twelve palacesThe BaZi side is the site engine table: Tiger-Horse-Dog to Yang Fire, Monkey-Rat-Dragon to Yang Water, Pig-Rabbit-Goat to Yang Wood, Snake-Rooster-Ox to Yang Metal
Enlarge diagram · scroll sideways to read
BaZi Moon VirtueZi Wei Yue DeBased onMonth branch, grouped by triadBirth-year branchWhat it returnsA heavenly stemA palaceExampleTiger month (Tiger-Horse-Dog group) gives Yang FireRat year gives SnakeWhere it landsOn a stem in the four pillarsOne of the twelve palacesThe BaZi side is the site engine table: Tiger-Horse-Dog to Yang Fire, Monkey-Rat-Dragon to Yang Water, Pig-Rabbit-Goat to Yang Wood, Snake-Rooster-Ox to Yang Metal
BaZi Moon Virtue turns the month-branch triad into a stem; Zi Wei Yue De turns the birth-year branch into a palace.

The two share a name but differ in basis, result and place of landing. A note should say "Zi Wei Yue De" or "BaZi Moon Virtue noble", never just "Moon Virtue". The BaZi star is explained in the Moon Virtue noble article.

Before recording a Yue De, align three things

  1. Birth-year branch

    Fix the branch of the birth year first, then read the branch where Yue De sits on the chart; the site changes the year at Lunar New Year, and if other software changes it at the Start of Spring, people born between the two may differ by one place.

  2. Start from the engine's Snake

    There is only one counting rule: Snake as Rat, count to the year branch. The "start from Rat" wording in juan 2 stays in the source column of the note.

  3. Leave the palace name to the Life palace

    Yue De supplies only a branch. What that branch is called depends on where this chart's Life palace sits, then counting back from it.

Two exercises

Exercise one

Born in a Pig year: which branch holds Yue De?

Pig is the twelfth name, the twelfth cell counted from Snake is Dragon, so Yue De sits at Dragon.

Exercise two

Born in a Horse year with the Life palace at Horse: which palace holds Yue De?

In a Horse year Yue De is at Pig; on a chart whose Life palace is at Horse, Pig is the Friends palace.

For where this star sits among the other minor stars and what limits apply, see supporting, malefic and minor stars; for the names and order of the twelve palaces, see the twelve palaces.

Questions readers ask next

Where exactly is my Yue De, and how do I look it up?

In two steps: the birth-year branch gives the branch where Yue De sits; then the branch of the Life palace on your chart turns that branch into a palace name. With Yue De at Pig, a chart whose Life palace is at Tiger calls it Children, and one whose Life palace is at Horse calls it Friends.

The name has "month" in it. Does the birth month matter?

The engine does not read the month for this star. Inside one year pillar, a January birth and a December birth have Yue De in the same place; it moves only when the branch of the birth year changes. The "month" in the name is traditional wording, not an input.

The book and the engine start from different places. Which one should I trust?

The material in hand confirms only two facts: the Wikisource text reads "start from Rat", and the engine code starts from Snake. Whether the gap comes from copying, editions or a school is not documented, so the site neither edits the book nor defends the engine; it records both.

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Sources & references

  1. 紫微斗數全書・卷二:安身命例(安天德月德解神諸訣) ↗
  2. iztro・星曜系统(十四主星名单与斗分) ↗
  3. iztro:紫微斗数宫位系统(宫名与地支、身宫和三方四正) ↗

Continue reading

Tian Shi (天使): Fixed in the Health Palace, with Two Placing Methods Giving Two Answers ↗

Tian De (天德): Count From Rooster to the Year, and Meet Its Twin List ↗